@altgate

Why I Canceled My CO2stats Account

The intertubes have been full of debate about this article from The Times.  The gist of the story is that is that the authors "reveal" that the internet uses electricity.  Specifically they call out Google for emitting 7 grams of carbon dioxide (quoting CO2stats founder Alex Wissner-Gross) per search and thereby infer Google is an environmental hypocrite.  After I read this I canceled my CO2stats account.

Now I've been a subscriber of CO2stats for a while (many of you may have noticed the little green badge on the site that is no more).  It's a feel-good service where publishers can buy offsets for the carbon dioxide emitted by the use of their website.  CO2stats uses a proprietary algorithm to figure out how much carbon is emitted, but essentially they look at traffic statistics to your site and infer from where the visit originates, where your servers are and what kind of computer the visitor is using how much energy is consumed.  Presumably they make this based on the energy mix of the location of the origination and termination.  Once this energy consumption is calculated, CO2stats sells offsets so that the site can claim they are carbon neutral and they make money in the arbitrage; essentially buying carbon offsets at $5 per ton and selling them at $200 or so.

So here is my beef (and why I canceled):

  1. The 7 grams statistics is misleading.  Presumably it is calculated to include the emissions from the computer of the person searching, as well as the network between them and Google as well as Google's infrastructure.  90+ percent of that energy is not attributable to Google, which is why they responded with a number more like 0.2 grams.  It's the equivalent of issuing a press release saying that "a pen bought at Wal-mart emits 1 kilogram of carbon" by including the emissions of the car the customer used to get to the store.  It's one thing to volunteer to pay to offset the emissions of your customer, but another thing totally to be "greenmailed" into it.
     
  2. Conflict of interest.  The Harvard physicist quoted in The Times article is none other than Alex Wissner-Gross, the founder of CO2stats who just happens to sell website carbon offsets.  The article authors mention this in passing, but not the conflict of interest.  That's shoddy reporting in my view.  Perhaps it was accidental on the part of Alex, but he seems to be exploiting his academic credentials for business gain which I suppose is his right to do but I don't like it.
     
  3. No cost/benefit analysis.  Sure the internet uses electricity (which produces emissions) but consider the alternative.  What about the upside?  How many trips were avoided, how many packages not mailed and how many phone calls eliminated because of the internet?  Don't you have to at least consider that in an expose on the environmenal hazards of searching the web?

Anyway, I found the whole story annoying and in protest cancelled my account.  Maybe it's an over reaction.  Look at the upside…I just saved $10 per month! ;-)  


Categorised as: Current Affairs


  • http://leveragingideas.com/ Sam Huleatt

    Great point! I have been wondering why no one mentions the opportunity costs associated with the Internet vs. its alternatives. Information and products need to get delivered…the web seems pretty darn good to me as a green solution

  • Vallia

    There’s a decent chance those points were made to the reporter but weren’t clarified in the article. You never know when the reporter tangles the interview– it sounds like you’re punishing co2stats solely because of the article when it’s difficult to understand just what the full perspective is from the CEO.

    You have a good point on the other pieces, but I’d love to see an update with comments from that company instead of the assumptions above.

    • http://www.altgate.com/ fnazeeri

      CO2stats started by saying, “hey, if you offset your customers footprint, it’s a great marketing tool” and somehow got caught up in aiding in attempted “greenmail,” which is essentially pursuing the right goal (in my view) by the wrong means. Trying to shame Google and others into compliance rubs me the wrong way.

      Your other point about getting snookered by a reporter is theoretically possible but unlikely. I’ve given hundreds of interviews and I can say that I always knew the reporter’s angle (admittedly I’ve never been targeted by 60 minutes). At best it’s naivete, which I considered, and I’m not sure that would change my view.

  • Kevin Butler

    You also just saved the CO2 emissions used by anyone who followed the links from your site to CO2Stats, and for the web requests to download & display the logo, etc.

    So you come out ahead, even by CO2Stats measures…

    Of course, by these measures, all inaction is better than any action.

    kb

  • lefty551

    The whole global warming farce is nothing but a big push to punish productive nations for being so. Notice how, with record cold and snowfallwe we now hear about “climate change” instead global worming. Plus, the arctic now has as much ice as it did in 1977 when Time predicted the “coming ice age.” Gosh, it ebbs and flows all on its own??? wohdathinkit?

  • http://reasonablyopinionated.com Alan Pinstein

    Good for you. This guy is such a troll. I just saw him on CNBC. He is also an idiot. He made the remark of “you use X co2 for every *second* you spend on someone’s site”, and “even browser window size has an effect”.

    It’s narcissistic trolls like Alex Wissner-Gross that make people ignore real problems because it lowers the public’s trust in do-gooder organizations.

    We need to be able to “certify” scientists in this world so that when idiots like this go on TV with a bunch of crap we need to be able to revoke their license.

    • http://www.altgate.com/ fnazeeri

      The name calling is unnecessary.

  • http://richi.co.uk/ Richi Jennings

    Today’s IT Blogwatch includes a bunch of opinions from around the Web, including some in-depth debunking of Wissner-Gross’s figures. http://blogs.computerworld.com/google_co2_claims_a_load_of_hot_air

  • http://outrunpoker.com Zak Kinion

    Too many shady people these days moving into the “Green Movement” as the next best place to make money…

  • GrammarPicker

    …thereby *imply* Google…

  • Scot

    Apparently, Wissner-Gross is claiming that the article has gravely misquoted him –
    http://news.cnet.com/8301-11128_3-10141432-54.html

  • http://yelirekim.com Mike Riley

    The times misconstrued the research performed by Wissner-Gross, he never attributed the carbon emissions to Google. The blame is not on the research, but The Times’ interpretation of it. Don’t be so harsh on CO2stats!

  • http://www.mypedtechnologies.com Graeme

    It even made a splash here in Australia. On NewsRadio (kind of like NPR) they interviewed someone from CO2Stats (might of been Alex).
    I have no problem with him spruiking his business, as long as the actual figures are correct and list their assumptions.

  • http://www.webhostingsearch.com/ Preeti

    I don’t know if I would call him a troll or anything but I did have the opportunity to speak to him about the article. He was very straight laced in his answers and you could tell he had already been through the ringer.

    If you would like to check out the interview and his thoughts: http://www.webhostingsearch.com/articles/google-wissner-gross-interview.php

    Carbon footprints and calculating it is quite subjective since no one has figured it out. It will be interesting to see how this changes over the upcoming years.

  • Glen

    Have you reconsidered this, considering that the Times story has been debunked — Wissner-Gross has said he did not make any calculations regarding Google specifically. You did overreact, IMO, and you should be boycotting the Times, not a carbon-offset program. “Feel good” or not, it does more good than harm — no harm at all, in fact. I will be using it for my sites — as soon as they’re up.

  • petebest

    I totally agree. It’s bogus to say “… thus neutralizing your site’s carbon footprint.”

    You can do nothing about the carbon that you spew into the atmosphere. Its there until nature
    deals with it. “Offset” = New World Order A scam perpetrated by Gore and his cronies.

    How the media plays into these scams is totally sick. Its just show how pathetic the global warming hoax is. A money grab.

  • http://www.newsouthernview.com Bill Pitts

    Selling offsets sounds like the Middle Age practice of selling indulgences.

    • http://www.altgate.com/ fnazeeri

      LOL. Great line. I just might use that one.

  • http://twitter.com/tomdidom thomas ummels

    And their customer service is non existent